Beware Elite Savings - Do Not Buy From These Scammers

[Hands0n]

I believe that I have become the victim of an on-line fraud, which is staggering as I am normally quite cautious about such things. The company name is Elite Savings (http://elitesavings.co.uk - if the website is still there), a web outfit run out of north London, supposedly.

They have drawn a great many people to their website by offering to sell technology goods at remarkable prices. For me I went for an HTC Desire for £309 - thats at least £100 better than anywhere else I could find. But I was not alone and there is a huge discussion about Elite Savings on the MoneySavingsExpert.com forum here --> http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=2517159

Basically, Elite Savings claim to be a 'broker'. That is, they collect a bundle of orders and then get these bulk-shipped into the UK. It can take up to 15 days for the orders to be collected after which they are sent to the shipper who then puts them all in a container and ships to the UK via an assortment of far and middle eastern countries. that could add another 30 days to the overall time. Then the goods have to clear customs before being shipped to the client.

All very well, so far. But when I find that the shippers website and tracking pages goes down with no holding page to offer an explanation. When I find that Elite Savings no longer responds to emails. And when I find that Elite Savings own website goes down - reportedly because of a malware infestation - I begin to hold significant doubts as to their authenticity. So to, apparently, do many tens of correspondents on the MoneySavingsExpert forum.

On Monday I am going to start proceedings to recover my money. I am not going to bother with Elite Savings who state that their card-handling company, MoneyBookers.com, will take 10% plus 50p refund handling charge. Under UK Distance Selling regulations Elite are in breach of contract by not supplying the goods within 30 days, leaving me entitled to a full, 100%, refund. But as they are not answering emails there is no negotiation to be had and so I'm turning it all over to my card company to recover and refund. They have much more muscle than me.

One final thing - Elite Savings T&Cs state that by making a purchase with them the customer waives their right to protection of the Distance Selling regulations. It is not legal for them to do this, and you are not able to waive your statutory rights. They're statutory!

I'll let you know the outcome. But my advice to everyone is to stay away from Elite Savings at all costs.

[Hands0n]

Update:

After writing an email to Elite Savings asking for a full refund I received the following response ...


Hi D****

Please contact your bank and get them to initiate your refund from moneybookers, back to your account as we are unable to do this as our refund terminal has been infiltrated by the Trojan virus.

Regards,

Online Team

Ridiculous.

[miffed]

Hands0n , dude ..... really don't want to sound condescending here , and especially to a guy like yourself who is probably one of the most switched on people I know of .....

BUT WHAT THE HELL WHERE YOU THINKING ???

(Best of luck with the refund though )

[Hands0n]

@miffed - You don't think that I'm not giving myself a right old kicking for being to damned stupid? :D

I thought long and hard about whether or not to try and buy from Elite Savings, I really did. Their price was unbeatable, and the logic was sound. Buy a crate of 50 and no doubt you'll get them at or around the kind of price that Vodafone will buy them in at. And their bulk deals all looked entirely reasonable too.

Its not that the price is cheap - it is completely understandable how to get the price that low. But that Elite Savings simply do not seem to be capable of delivering to the plot. I can't see why not, unless they've been let down by their upstream suppliers. Its all in the Far East and that is a minefield in itself.

Oh well, it will be in the hands of the card company on Monday. I'm not going to MoneyBookers directly who will cream off 10% +50p for the experience. I did nothing wrong and neither Elite Savings or MB are not entitled to a penny of my money.

But apart from all of that ... yes I do feel BLOODY STUPID right now :o :mad:

[Hands0n]

I spoke with my bank today - the card team are not around weekends and evenings. They have referred me to the Verified by Visa card team to raise a "Dispute" to try and retrieve the funds from MoneyBookers. At least if the bank take up the quest they will secure a 100% refund whereas MoneyBookers will take off 10% plus 50p for doing so. This is going to be a right pickle because MoneyBookers have already paid Elite Savings ...

Today, Sunday, I dragged eldest son out of his slumbers to go in to his store at P4U to arrange a substitute for the youngest lad. Currently I'm paying Vodafone £20 each month for a 30-day SIM Only with 300 minutes, Unlimited (3,000) texts and 500MB Internet. P4U have scraped up on a £30 deal for 18 months which includes a free HTC Desire (unbranded, SIM-free), 600 mins, Unlimited texts and 500MB Internet. That means that, over the period of the contract, I will have paid £180 for the HTC Desire.

Not quite what I wanted, but I suppose in the end it all works out in favour as the younger lad is very good at keeping his technology in good condition. He's not like some under 18s who wreck their kit a month into their contract.

[miffed]

Reading through that thread , it was suggested that the whole basis of this scam is that 10% + 50p ,and there never were any suppliers , goods or carriers.
Plenty of hopeful people clutching onto tracking numbers , but no- one with receipt of any goods at all , this creates a bizarre situation where people who have just been ripped off for �40.50 , are actually PLEASED about it because they have got �359.50 of their �400 back , and they see this as a positive result !

Not sure how you will fare TBH though - (I sincerely hope you DO get it all back) ... But I am just thinking that AS YET , the company have not deviated from their obligation ? You have agreed (by placing the order ? ) to their weird terms and conditions WRT to refunds etc . so are your bank going to consider you "defrauded" ? , By opting out of the procedures that normally push prices up (VAT etc) , do you also waive your statutory rights ?
No idea if what I am suggesting is true , pure speculation on my part , it just looks to me that the guys running this site/scam appear to be chugging along quite happily - My guess is that they have finely tuned this scam (if that is what it is )

Reel in customers - Get them to agree to T & C WRT refunds
Let them down
Give them the refund as agreed
Pocket the difference



Lets hope you can report back with a positive outcome !

[Hands0n]

Yes, it was a very troublesome read through that forum and I good the same feeling that you did. I can't believe that people are happy to just chuck their £40.50 the way of Elite Savings and/or MoneyBookers for nothing at all, and through no fault of their own other than trying to search down an internet bargain.

WRT to the T&Cs - as far as I am aware, and I may be completely wrong on this, but it is not possible for a citizen to waive their Statutory Rights. They are on the statute books and thats that. Within those statutes there are often waivers - but I cannot see in the Distance Selling regulations anything that suggests that I can waive the rights wholesale.

Within those rights enshrined in UK law the supplier, Elite Savings, has 30 days to fulfil their obligations. If they are not able to do so, for any reason, I have the 'right' to require a full refund. And that is what I now require. I have a saved off copy of their web page that clearly states that the lead time is 15 days. At the very least the advertised sale is misleading. I really do not see that Elite Savings are on a strong footing at all. But, again, I may be completely wrong.

The key to my success, or otherwise, is whether or not the Bank decides to take up my Dispute claim. I will stress that Elite Savings have indicated that they have no possibility of delivery to my order - and moreso that their email response to my enquiry makes a very strong suggestion to me that they have no intention of doing so.

This is so maddening...

[The Mullet of G]

I'm frankly shocked that you were foiled by such an obvious scam, I'll have to downgrade your stock value to "at risk" Seriously though I really hope you get your money back, and I agree on the point about statutory rights, I don't believe it is possible to wave them.

[Hands0n]

Cheers for the vote of confidence :D :o But I suppose I really did bring that upon myself :p

I am in correspondence with another Elite Savings "victim" and am advised that the company who was doing the buying and shipping had gone bust. Possibly that is the reality. But he was also told that he would get a full 100% refund from Money Bookers, the credit card company that took the payment. MB are registered under the FSA and are therefore regulated by UK law, so I reckon that protection is there.

Meanwhile, in my case, my bank has written to me to get the details of the transaction, any evidence I have (i.e. eMails) and a signature on a form. They will run with it and get the refund I am due via their Disputes procedures. It may take 6 - 8 weeks but I don't really care. The money came out of my "Toys Fund" and so is not needed to live on ;) I just want it back, eventually.

It is a crying shame that it did all go wrong. There was so much potential - 20 HTC Desires for £2,000. Blimey, I tell you, I was tempted. Even with a short term loan, you'd get it back and more by selling them off for £320 a pop which is well under the shop price today.

[Ben]

Ah, the beauty of paying by card. Authentication (i.e. VBV) may confuse matters a little, but at the end of the day any such purchase should be easily redeemable under a goods-not-supplied/not-as-described dispute.

[The Mullet of G]

If you get all of your money back and it appears that you will then its all good, nothing ventured nothing gained and all that. I can kinda see where you got drawn in, as in theory the idea should be able to work and produce profit, but in reality they can effectively make money from doing nothing, and it would seem they are opting for the latter option.

I'd be willing to upgrade your stock value to "making returns" if you get your money back, and it would also be nice to see the system work in favour of the good guy. :)

[miffed]

:cool:I'll be glad when this is all sorted and ancient history ! , as it is I feel duty bound to get the spam deleted off here quicker than usual , in case Danny sees it and decides to give them a chance !:p:confused::rolleyes::cool:

[Hands0n]

LOL @miffed - cruel but fair, its a fair cop and all that :o

Thanks mullet, I can't wait for the upgrade. Its so depressing to see the stock value so low right now :eek:

I think I'll have to stick with the regular and known retailers. Ironically, I got an even better deal by going to P4U and getting a £30 contract - that works out at £10 more a month over 18 months (or £180 for the HTC Desire with no cost of funding), same number of Texts and Internet MBs plus an additional 300 mins over what he had before! Crazy.

This experience hasn't put me off buying SIM-free. But as ever before I'll not be seeking out such bargain-basement offers in future.

[The Mullet of G]

I wont lie I'll still worry about you. I'd feel a lot safer if we revoked your ebay privileges, but I'm hoping it doesn't have to come to that or some sort of awkward intervention where we force you to agree to a pocket money system, where you get £20 a week to spend on comics and sweets etc. :p

[Hands0n]

Oooooh, I can feel the vultures circling :)

[miffed]

Any news on this Hands0n ?

[Hands0n]

@miffed - its still out with the bank. They said 8 - 12 weeks before they make up their mind and decide what to do. Elite Savings have definitely gone and disappeared from the face of the planet.

As soon as the bank tell me what they're going to do I'll post it up on here.

[Hands0n]

Well, it took a little while but its all sorted - for now :)

It looks as if Elite Savings has gone bust, and rightly so. Their website no longer exists.

The bank has returned my money in full - but under the constant threat that if Elite Savings subsequently give information that they were prepared to deliver my to my order that the bank will claw the refund back! That appears to be the constant threat that consumers are under if they raise a "dispute" using the bank's protection scheme.

But all's well that ends well. I've got my money back and ready to spend elsewhere :)

[miffed]

Good to hear you are not out of pocket ! .. I can't help but wonder if "give information that they were prepared to deliver my to my order" means simply claim , or prove their position ?

[Hands0n]

I don't know. The call centre script was suitably vague!

[The Mullet of G]

Glad to hear you got it all sorted out and that you didn't lose any money as a result.

I doubt Elite Savings will cause you any further problems, its likely they are now doing much the same thing under a different name though.

[Hands0n]

I wouldn't be at all surprised if they were. It sounded like a good idea at the time, famous last words :) I suppose that what this really teaches me is to maintain my sceptic approach, don't be first, if it looks too good then it most probably is. :D

[The Mullet of G]

I think we all need a reminder from time to time, its easy to get caught out online these days as the internet is awash with scams and fake stuff. So it always pays to be that extra bit skeptical about amazing offers, but human nature and the enjoyment that comes from scoring the ultimate bargain mean we'll get caught out from time to time. If you can learn something from it without being out of pocket, then I'd say thats a pretty good result in the end. :D