[Hands0n]

.... and not one of them are 3G http://www.vodafone.com/mobile_world/announcements/vodafone_extends_range.html

One has to wonder. It is not as if manufacturing cheap 3G handsets is difficult or time consuming. Look at what 3 did with the Ameo made in China just for them. A few more bob spent could have netted Vodafone a real exclusive 3G handset tailored to their network.

These two? Not for me thanks all the same.

[Ben]

Of course there's many ways of looking at this development. If Vodafone can create a consistent mobile brand, while the devices themselves are made by many different manufacturers, then that would be quite an achievement. Image, for example, a loyal customer of the 'Nokia' brand, accepting handsets that, in reality, have been made by all sorts of different people but are consistent enough that they feel like part of a family.

If this is what Vodafone are trying to do then starting with low end, basic handsets is probably the best way forward.

[Hands0n]

I hear ya but ...... Vodafone need a signature handset, and neither of these is it. In fact they have not had one to my recollection for an awfully long time. Given the state of the art the big red's signature handset needs to be 3G compliant, HSDPA, the works. It does not have to be a Smartphone - but something that does quite a bit. Look at what is possible with the zzzPhone (https://talk3g.co.uk/showthread.php?t=5014&highlight=zzzphone) for $149 (£74.50) and ask yourself what Vodafone could have done with their bargaining power!

Give it a year or two and all the mobile network operators will be doing this. And the established manufacturers will be pooping themselves. The economics are impossible for a corporate FD to ignore!

[gorilla]

Words fail me.

How do they expect to recoup their 3g licence investment by continually investing in non 3g handsets? Surely it would make sense to push customers onto 3g handsets without them even realising. Subtle marketing, like "did you know you can check your email, browse the latest news" etc without blinding customers with 3g this and 3g that.

I blame WAP, lets start a campaign to get rid of it!

[Hands0n]

Words fail me.

Depressing, isn't it. The likes of Vodafone are so utterly conservative that they wouldn't know an imaginative thought if they sat on one! Just try and imagine what that huge corporation could have negotiated with the likes of zzzPhone?

I am actualy very tempted to buy a zzzPhone just to see what its like. The spec is superb for the price. I have to wonder how much they'd shift for on eBay :D Could easily double the price I'd have thought!

[3GScottishUser]

Hold on.....

What is all this about?

Vodafone have been at the forefront of offering 3G to the widest audience. They have everything from own brand handsets at the £70 PAYG end of the scale through to £100 SE 3G handsets and just about every high spec 3G handset on contracts. They also have neat 3G HSDPA dongles etc.

GSM handsets still account for about 70% of the UK market according to recent research. That's because fashion and looks with reliable basic functions are what most folks want. The big must haves for youngsters are slimline camera phones with BT and music/video facilities. Data charging means that 3G simply does not matter for most.

For most networks it must be frustrating subsidising 3G handsets that simply end up used like GSM ones. It's a problem created by their own stupid greedy and shortsighted data pricing which has excluded most from Internet use. The other problem is that whilst mobile Internet could compete with fixed line broadband and could be an attractive product the vast majority of customers probably won't want it and will stick to voice, SMS and MMS.

Vodafone's latest cheapies are a move to equip and empower more 3G customers but perhaps without the high costs passing vast sums to the likes of Nokia whos top end phones are probably only used by a fraction of owners to their optimum potential.

[Hands0n]

Yes, but the problem is that these two new handsets are not 3G at all. They perpetuate the need to keep the old 2G network running. Sure, no one is suggesting 2G be shut down overnight. But surely there are sufficient 2G handsets without needing to create yet more, and not particularly attractive ones at that.

Signature handset for me suggests state of the art to fly the company's flag. These two just don't do it.

[solo12002]

" Vodafone have been at the forefront of offering 3G to the widest audience" Indeed so how come 3SGU you now with three?

I tottally agree there are more than enought 2g mobiles out there, Networks at this stage should ensure new handsets are 3g only this will help with closure of the 2g networks in years to come and enable network users to think about using 3g services when the networks drop their prices.

I for one dont think its the fact no one is keen on 3g, I think its solely the fact that networks have not priced 3G correctly. Examples of this are:

3 Broadband lite £10 per GB, but £1 per meg over it = over a grand
3 Broadband £10 for 1GB but 10p over it = £102 pounds
Vodafone £15 for £GB (Offer) but £15 per GB over it

Virgin has one of the hateful crap 3g offerings you can get Virgin bites which is more suitable to a 5 year old and no data plans at all.

I think your over rates should be no more than normal rates ie £15 for 3GB then over run rate should be £15 for 3 GB of over run, as for MMS and video calls still to pricey. I also think roaming rates not only for calls, text but data should all still come down, if they did more ppl would use their mobiles while roaming not only for calls etc but for data and this can only lead to increase profits for networks.

As for the networks and ofcom. The whole thing iis a joke, we have three and T-mobile sharing 3g masks, while three use Orange for 2g roaming. All the others networks have wee deals and agreements with each other which you have to question.

And yes I swear once one network has a price plan they all appear to follow and have the same plan, not that Im implieing its all fixed, of course OFCOM would never allow that (COUGH)!

[3GScottishUser]

What is the life of a typical handset these days?

12 months for some cheaper PAYG ones, 18-24 months for higher spec models?

I have watched how youngsters treat devices and its astonishing how beat up an LG Viewty can get in a teen's hands within a couple of months!!

GSM is going to be around for a good while yet and until there are cheapies with the spec at the right price point I dare say Vodafone and others will offer GSM branded models to make the maximum profit. I think the idea is to take models designed for emerging markets and through volume deals they can sell them in the UK and other developed markets at a reasonable profit.

This does not help the 3G cause for sure but as ever that is not an issue for Vodafone who just want to extract as much profit from subscribers for as little investment as possible.

I don't particularly like the two new models either but I can appreciate why they are being offered.

[Hands0n]

............but I can appreciate why they are being offered.

And I, for one, cannot and refuse to. This is a very mature and saturated market. As such the expectations here are significantly and very much higher than in, say, Botswana or suchlike. To offer 3rd world handsets in this market is bordering on an insult to the intelligence.

I make no apology for repeating - Vodafone could have gone to the likes of zzzPhone (there are probably hundreds of such offerings in China) and had an own-brand (whitelable) signature handset custom built for their own network. The device would have cost Vodafone a few tens of pounds in the volumes that they could buy at, and would gain them a wider margin than paying the likes of Nokia. No doubt Vodafone could have named their own price.

Just take a look at the baseline spec of the zzzPhone, it is astonishing. Bolt on a few bits and you will still have £100's left out of what you might pay for a comparable handset from the Nokias of this world.