[3GScottishUser]

3 is preparing for a major facelift of its main consumer tariffs in a bid to increase its market share and bolster its margins, Mobile has learned.

The operator has been planning a range of new tariffs through which customers pay at least part of the cost of the handset.

The cheapest will be a £15-per-month tariff with no handset. Users will have the option of paying a further £2 per month to get a basic phone, or a total of £25 per month for top-range handsets, all with the same airtime.

'I think it's a reasonable idea,' said Julien Parven of Fone Logistics. 'This is starting to put some value back into the handset. The idea of £300 handsets being given away is ridiculous.'

A major high street retailer told Mobile: 'The new tariffs they are looking at will separate the handset and airtime. It will be £15 for an airtime-only package and then more to get a basic phone.

'They are also planning to launch new higher ARPU tariffs in the £30-£35 range for the final quarter to complete the suite.'

The operator has already slashed its acquisition costs by 43% in the last six months compared with the previous year, and the revamp of the loss-making £15-per-month tariff is a pragmatic move to raise margins and help it get into profit.

3's overhaul of its high tariffs will be to make it more competitive at the top end of the range.

Orange's pay-monthly chief Crispin Tristram told Mobile he was watching 3's manoeuvres with interest: 'We are not going to come out with a £15 low-cost tariff…we can see they [rivals] are doing it for market share. We are watching it curiously, but it does not pay back.'

Christmas at 3

Fergal Walker, UK director of handsets, said 3 was growing the series from a 'relatively limited range of 12' handsets in May to 24 key handsets in October. The network will ditch 'old phones', such as the K610i, in favour of exclusive colour variants, the Nokia 6120 white and the red Sony Ericsson W660i, along with 'aspirational' new handsets, the Sony Ericsson K850, W910 and LG KU990. 'There are some big sellers at the low end for us – the K530i and the K770 Cyber-shot.'

http://www.mobiletoday.co.uk/content/16793.asp?men=0&sub=1

[Ben]

I quite like the idea of the same tariff being charged at different levels depending on the handset being had. I'm looking forward to seeing what happens.

[Ronin47]

i wonder when this will be in effect ?

[solo12002]

I think it wil be in oct reading beween the lines in the link.

I worry that this is a back ward step. Net we will go back to the days of charging £35 fee to join the network and I sure thay could charge us to port numbers.

[Hands0n]

There is nothing to legally prevent the networks for charging to port a number. I don't think that the networks are that together - despite the GSMA cartel - to collectively start increasing their charges. Not in a saturated market like the UK. As soon as they start to see one of their competitors experience Customer attrition the others will back away.

What we may witness is a return to basics - core business - in an attempt to save money. After all, apart from voice, text and, increasingly, data now the tariffs are beginning to shift in the right direction, everything else they've tried has been a dismal failure. Content? They mostly do it badly. Portals - well enough said about them, they're none of them too appealing. Much better exists in the wider Internet. Videocalling - they gave up before they tried, killed it off by overpricing it! The list goes on.

The handset makers like Nokia and Apple have seen the light and are starting to chuck their own weight around. Finally, letting the dog wag the tail. Other manufacturers will follow suit. Those networks that refuse to carry the handsets that they feel threaten their own meagre content revenue will become marginalised by the manufacturers and buying Customer. The relationship between network and manufacturer is bound to become more symbiotic. The dominant/slave relationship between the two is going to erode as the handsets get "smarter" and offer more capabilities.

[neil]

If three are going to have a bring your own mobile tariff then would it work with HSDPA? would HSDPA only work with mobiles on the £17,£25,£30,£35 tariffs when bought from three directly? o2 offer a sim only pay monthly deal so I'm wondering if three will do the same.

should I get a Nokia 6120 classic now or wait to see how the tariffs work out.

If three offered a 12 month contract would I be charged extra for a 'free' mobile which I could get for free on a 18 month contract.

so many questions so little time :D until 1st October.

[getti]

HSDPA is on the network so if you have a 3 USIM and a HSDPA phone and get HSDPA signal then yes you would get the faster speeds

[neil]

once again I wasn't clear getti :o

If I bought a HSDPA handset, got a 3 USIM, bought a £15 month plan would I be able to get the 'Broadband Lite 1GB' £10 add-on = £25 per month.

thanks,
Neil.

[getti]

Yes you can

[neil]

great, thanks getti, I can't wait for 1st October :)

[Hands0n]

Why? What happens then :D :D

[3GScottishUser]

Quite sad that 3's data speeds are less than half of those offered by Vodafone and T-Mobile despite 3 having more bandwidth than both of them.

Oh well, we shall have to see how users experience the services but the poorer speed does not look like a selling feature for 3.

[getti]

tmobile hsdpa 1.8mb
3 hsdpa 2.8mb

Tmobile's is slower but for now they have more hsdpa coverage. By december 3 will have the same hsdpa coverage but faster speeds

[Hands0n]

The speeds thing is pretty much an irrelevance as there is plenty of slack for the competing companies to crank up the speed as and when they see fit. This is an even race inasmuch as the actual technology has the potential to perform the same.

What is not clear in the UK yet is whether 3 have made the same mistakes that they made in Ireland, and which made a lot of their Customers entirely fed up.

I did go into the 3 store on Saturday - checked out the offer - but the link was running at non-HSDPA (Bluewater) and so I walked out without one. Went along to T-Mobile and upgraded my contract to an N95. Demo kit needs to work well to impress, this time it didn't.

[solo12002]

If this is correct. the new plans from three look they could match/beat flex??

follow the link:

http://www.mobiletoday.co.uk/content/16925.asp?men=0&sub=1

[getti]

I had my training and the info and it does look to be an amazing offer of plans and handsets from next month

[Hands0n]

I need to see that in 3-print :) But it does not appear to be a "Flext killer". Texts and Minutes are the same price on 3's package. On Flext minutes and texts are different price from the monthly allocation of £s cash.

I'd say that 3 are making inroads to the territory exclusively occupied by T-Mobile's Flext. But that is at best. The Jury's out until the package arrives on the doorstep.

[solo12002]

From what I can read on the link it looks it. im glad I waited a month.

For me living in Northern Ireland three has the best 3G coverage, home like home rates so if it hit the south of Ireland they are taken from my price plan, on top of that the lowest roaming charges of any network, and x-series. To top it off 3GB FU limit on mobile broadband for £15 quid.

I wanted to get flex and web and walk but t-mobile coverage is crap here in bangor NI, the new plan looks as if I get what I wanted from t-mobile and at cheaper prices to boot.

Im not a fan of three due to a past encounter with them , crap handset poor network, and issues with CS, even so I do have to praise them for makeing some bold steps.

It really looks as if I cant hold back anymore, i can see three getting me

[hecatae]

tmobile hsdpa 1.8mb
3 hsdpa 2.8mb

Tmobile's is slower but for now they have more hsdpa coverage. By december 3 will have the same hsdpa coverage but faster speeds

what's the contention ratio?

[3g-g]

what's the contention ratio?

There is no contention ration for HSDPA, it's not like ADSL.

If there are no other HSDPA users on the cell you're currently using you'll get a nice quick connection. If it's busy then the speeds will be slower.

[neil]

from the price guide:

priceguideocto7.pdf version1

http://www.three.co.uk/customer/linkdocument.omp?cid=1089021441077

Mix & Match300 £15 300 uk voice or texts 18 months
Mix & Match500 £18 500 uk voice or texts 18 months
Mix & Match700 £21 700 uk voice or texts 18 months
Mix & Match900 £24 900 uk voice or texts 18 months
Mix & Match1100 £27 1100 uk voice or texts 18 months

[neil]

the Nokia 6120 classic is free throughout the mix&match plans but the N95 is £12 per month but you do get 120 mins of video calling.

also the Sony Ericsson K770i Purple & Video Pack with 30 video calling mins
£3 per month

[chajun]

I really don't know why 3 are going to bother with changing when they can't even manage their exising tarrifs!. My wife and I signed up at the Princes street Edinburgh store in Jan for £17.50 for 18 mths. On the 7th month they doubled it. I had already double checked that it was as per my contract.

All because "someone forgot to do the next six months manualy" Amateur night out Even the Executive office in Glasgow treat customers like fools.


As soon as the contract ends, We are off else where.


EXECUTIVE OFFICE PLEASE NOTE!

[Ben]

Manually? Wow, their customer systems must still be pretty awful!

Thanks for sharing! :)

[chajun]

That's what I was told yesterday. It beggars belief! The attitude of the Exec office leaves a lot to be desired. To use the quaint old expression." I haven't just arrived on a milk train"

I wonder if anybody else has had these problems?

[3g-g]

I wonder if anybody else has had these problems?

What? Problems with Three? Never! *insert sarcastic tone here*

That's a can o' worms asking about that topic!!

[chajun]

I wouldn't mind sampling of some other peoples woe'sssssssss to see if there are any similarities.

[Hands0n]

OMG! *next bit in John MacEnroe voice* I can't believe you are serious! ;)

*back to normal voice* - You have found what pretty much everyone who becomes aggrieved with 3 finds. That their CS is {expletive removed} awful beyond belief. It is utterly indescribable how inept 3's behind the scenes so-called Customer Support is. They have the innate ability to snatch defeat from the hands of success like no other. They have perfected the art of, in a word, futility. Everything they touch turns to sand.

Now all that is a crying shame - because 3's technology is rather good. As is their 3G coverage. Their website and support systems (i.e. My 3) are excellent. Their product range varies from rather good to booooooooorrrrrinnnnnggggg. But it is not actually bad since they stopped buying NEC. Their tariffs are a bit weird, not always easy to understand - but there are some nuggets in there. Their PAYG is not worth discussing.

If you do a search on here about 3 you'll find quite a bit of discussion - both good and bad. Our Irish friends seem to have quite a lot of good to say about 3, with the exception of CS but don't get me going, I'll only start swearing again. :)

You will also find a lot of negative about 3, and quite a few disaffected like yourself.

Basically, when you most need 3's support you find it is simply not there, and that it tends to treat you like something that needs scraping off the bottom of a shoe! 3 do not know at all what a Customer is - it is a systemic problem that will be very hard to shift. They have been in attrition since their launch and nothing has changed in over four years. That they have survived this long with the curse of Gerald Ratner hanging over them is a miracle - he treated his Customers with contempt and they drove him to the wall.

3 are a complete paradox. By all of the natural laws they should not still be here. Perhaps they really are Satan's spawn.


Edit: If you want to get terminally depressed at buying into 3 you could always visit the folk over at Grumbletext (http://www.grumbletext.co.uk/vt.php?t=82&subj=complaints+3+mobile+complaint) :D Don't say I didn't warn you though :D

[gorilla]

Aha. You see i've yet to have a really bad experience. Once i had a problem the PAC they gave me, but other than that it's be ok. This time round has been pretty good. Their coverage has definitely improved. I sympathise with your problems though as i know call centres can be a right pain.

[hecatae]

gorilla, stop jinxing it.

[3GScottishUser]

The new Mix & Match plans look really good value and the idea of making the price different to take account of more advanced and expensive handsets is a really good one.

I was browsing on Saturday in my local mall and for once the 3 Store was quite busy, especially with younger folks. I can see parents buying the Mix & Match deal for their teens as it offers them lots of voice and texts for a reasonable monthly cost and they can get MSN saving them on texts too.

All of a sudden one has to do some serious calculations re converged deals. I currently pay BT for line rental and have Orange Canary 30 which offers loads of minutes, texts and free 2Mb/s broadband plus free IP calls to UK landlines, 100 countries and Orange mobiles. It's due for renewal in December and both TalkTalk and 02 have LLU on my exchange. TalkTalk offer 5.5Mb/s Broadband, free off-peak landline calls and calls to 30 countries for £16.50 a month including line rental. 3 offer loads of minutes and texts for £18 a month and a decent handset complete with free MSN, Yahoo, News and 30 minutes worth of video calls (free BT headset too). So a potential saving, a handset upgrade, free faster broadband and the option to expand use with some cheap add-on's. The drawbacks: TalkTalk's £30 connection charge, £20 Wireless router charge and £70 disconnection charge. That factors in a hefty small print excess charge of £120. I will have to look at the finer detail and will also explore 02's new converged deals when they are announced this week.

I think I will be moving for sure but where is uncertain.... suggestions?

[Hands0n]

Mobiles aside, Sky's converged TV, Talk and Broadband (See, Speak, Surf) is an attractive proposition for three-play. Their capped Base (free), Mid (£5pm) and uncapped Max (£10pm) are extraordinary value. But Sky do not, as of yet, have a Mobile offering to complete the deal.

However, if you are a Sky customer already it does rather help take the load off the non-mobile thinking. That leaves you free to explore what mobile deals you can secure, especially if you are considering mobile data too. 3 are making good inroads to supply affordable data packages - all the more extraordinary considering their early walled garden aproach. But one must go into 3 deals with completely open eyes - the issues that have driven many away in the past still exist. 3 are rather hostile towards their Customer base when things go wrong.

I do not honestly feel that any of the mobile operators or their MVNOs supply a full Fourplay deal that is what it says on the tin. We can still discount TV over Broadband - especially with the current interpretation of the English word "Unlimited". An evening's viewing will bust most operators BB caps.

Difficult to know what to suggest for you old fella. I think that my best advice is to create a wish list and then see which operator fits the closest. For me, right now, it is T-Mobile Flext 35 with Web 'n Walk Plus (3GB data). It isn't bargain basement cheap but it does everything that I want it to. And that, in the analysis, is precisely what counts - for me.